not that sick, wtf?

[nick]

No advice-you've heard it all before anyway.So,I'll spare you,but what I will say is,much luck with it,man-I hope you get where you want to go as painlessly as possible.

[Dopeless Hopefiend]

@Esoteric Anhydride honestly the intense pwd was over after 24 hours or so, then for another week or so I felt a bit...off. I don't know how else to explain it. I wasn't exactly sick but just didn't feel right at all. After that I pretty much evened out as far as withdrawal is concerned, but it's been a rough transition. I wish I would've gotten down lower on the MD, 30mg was too high to jump from. I know other people who've done it the exact same way as me & been just fine but that sure wasn't my experience. I've been on sub for 40 days and I'm still not sure it was a good choice for me. If I didn't have chronic pain issues I would likely feel differently, but unfortunately I do. My doctor was adamant that bupe provides pain control but I call bullshit on that. I think it does fuck all for pain. I also don't think it holds me nearly as long as methadone. When I was on MMT there were numerous times that I just forgot to take my dose one day & felt fine, with sub I wake up feeling like shit. That could be residual effects from methadone still, but I don't know.
I'm really glad to be out from under the clinic & all of the associated bullshit, but it's been a hell of a journey.

[Esoteric Anhydride (OP)]

@Dopeless Hopefiend : From what I've read, a standard sized dose of bup for pain is like .5mg -- very small, MUCH smaller than a maintenance dose. Bup is a really weird drug, IDK what you're dosing, but if you haven't tried getting by on like 2-4mg or less, you might do better on less (assuming you're taking more than that). But ya, I hear you on the pain issues, I have quite a bit too, and I have concerns over how I'll do on bup alone.

@Z : I think this might be a really good idea, from experience with other inductions, I think microdosing would work for me so I think Ima try it, I'm just not sure how it's gonna work being so saturated with 'done, but fuck it. Tomorrow I'll suck a tiny little crumb and then wait 20-30 minutes before my shot. Hopefully I don't blow a fuse before I can get some dope in behind the bup. I'm doing a fast xanax taper too off a fairly short & small dose bender, but still plenty to feel it these days, so this could get interesting. Depending on how things go, it might be two days before I can eat the first crumb, but I'll post back on how this works out.

@nick : thanks man, I appreciate it. 

[Dopeless Hopefiend]

Yeah, I've heard that about bupe too. I'm currently on 16mg a day split into 2 doses. Being used to taking full agonist opis it's hard for me to wrap my head around the idea of less is more, but it seems to be the general consensus. 

[dizzle]

everybody gets one


let family guy illustrate this point:








BINGO!

no for real this happens sometimes, it's almost like you have this shit in your head built up to be absolute hell, then when it happens, it's like, "well that's not that bad!" still though, it doesn't happen often, so enjoy.

[Esoteric Anhydride (OP)]

@dizzle: I hear your point bro but full-on dopesick isn't still constipated, isn't not-pukey (for me anyway), isn't not-kicking the covers all over the place and able to sleep. I was maybe 2/3 of the way there, after >20years at this game, I know dopesick really well, at least I know my dopesick really well.

Circumstances didn't allow for me to suck a crumb of sub this am. Tomorrow, for sure..

Can I get some cliff notes for the video? I don't have audio on this machine.

@Dopeless Hopefiend : Way too much! Seriously, cut that back to 1/4 of what you're taking now. I can almost guarantee you'll feel better. I've never had to take more than 12mg at induction, which I always then throttle back to 2-6mg (within a couple days), which is where my blocking threshold is with bup.

[DeadCat]

Bupe is a kind of paradoxical drug.

One time I had injured a sciatic nerve which is extremely painful and can last for a month. At the ER I ws given a bottle of what I thought would be crappy extended realeas "Oraomorph" tablets of no more than 100 mg each. I think I had  2mg of bupe in the AM that day which woud normally at least interfere with any opiate high. I wasn't expecting much pain relief even but...

The bupe and morphine must have mutually potentiated or something but before I knew it I was high as fuck! It was one of those dreamy, blissful, "I love everybody highs" and I started calling old girfriends telling them all sorts of nice things and I got "[DeadCat], are you high or what?" replies.

Sadly though after that one first time experience it never worked again the whoe month I was taking the morphine, which is generally what I get from oral morphine, nothing.

Other topic: Full-On w/d and constipation. I've had this happen. It is very uncomfortable. Your bowels are trying to let everything go but extended opiate use has left you with a brick blocking the way. A dope friend of mine and I would call it "The Plug"  and it really is exactly that, a physical block to colon spasms and relief.  Wow. Really unpleasant memory there..

[Esoteric Anhydride (OP)]

^^ 2mg bup isn't that much, I can take 4mg and then go get loaded off a normal issue inside 2hrs. My blocking dose of bup starts at about 6mg, but with effort I can even punch through that.

I just did something really stupid. I went to jab some Test and grabbed the narcan instead and muscled 1ml/.4mg, right after muscling about a half g of dope - oops! I didn't even catch it, my GF did - "is THIS what you just shot?"

How's that for a dipshit move? I feel ok, I don't think .4mg is very much, but umm... Doh!

[Bodytec]

Off/on topic...I've started doing my test with a dope pin(1cc 29ga 1/2"). It works pretty good,just slow. Backload the pin with a regular 3cc syringe. Being strung out on tea and opiates is my life story. Together they make me a He-man. Just don't bomb off of both at the same time ...makes a man into a mouse.

[Esoteric Anhydride (OP)]

A .5" pin is pretty short for an IM shot, hopefully you don't have much of a fat layer where you're injecting; I'd recommend using at least a 1" pin, but you didn't ask me..

OK so I got my first "microdose" of bup down before my wake-up this am. Nothing noteworthy happened, I just sucked a crumb of our favorite little orangey tasty treats and waited 20 minutes.

Props to @Z for the idea. Microsing bup makes a lot of sense to me, hopefully it will make my full induction here in a couple days a bit easier..

[Dog Food]

Im doin the same thing today,. Gonna take at least a mg though, since i got some fire dope to do soon then after.  Its odd how bupe works for me anymore.  Like ill take a mg or two, then do dope the rest of the day, then tomorrow ill be straight to take sub itself.

[Esoteric Anhydride (OP)]

Its odd how bupe works for me anymore.  Like ill take a mg or two, then do dope the rest of the day, then tomorrow ill be straight to take sub itself.

Yep, exact same thing here. Take a mg, do some dope, good to go.

I've been saying this for years. Not sure how many ppl believe me, it's good to read that other ppl have the same experience.

The microdose went very smoothly this am. Tempted to take another crumb later on today, but tomorrow for sure I'll take like 2 crumbs..

[Dog Food]

Yeah, thats the only way i can introduce bupe into my system without a whole lotta pain and agogny.  I ended up taking a quarter of one of my pills, then did my big shot about 45 mins after. 

I just don't have the added time and money for dope that several days of taking micro doses for several days. Thats why i like to take a decent sub dose(2-4mg) then i can take em as scripted tomorrow. well see how tomorrow goes and ill report back on what happens with just subs

[nikita70]

Bupe is a kind of paradoxical drug.
(...)
The bupe and morphine must have mutually potentiated or something but before I knew it I was high as fuck! It was one of those dreamy, blissful, "I love everybody highs" and I started calling old girfriends telling them all sorts of nice things and I got "[DeadCat], are you high or what?" replies.
(...)
Other topic: Full-On w/d and constipation. I've had this happen. It is very uncomfortable. Your bowels are trying to let everything go but extended opiate use has left you with a brick blocking the way. A dope friend of mine and I would call it "The Plug"  and it really is exactly that, a physical block to colon spasms and relief.  Wow. Really unpleasant memory there..

This^^^ I've never ever mentioned about it or asked for, since I AM A LADY and claiming to be perceived as some disembodied creature, blah blah.
(looks being a drug addict and status of incorporeal one excluding each other).

HOWEVER, this is what I used to kinda euphemistic call as "BOTHERSOME SIDE EFFECTS" of synthetical opioids with a long half life.

Methadone is bad enough as for constipation, but this bupe is some real...well, SHIT, must be said. It's like... neither in this way nor another, lol.
I always wonder how perfidious and nasty it is. This is why I used to keen on short acting opies (those natural ones as possible)-ALL the results (those desirable ones and tiring up) seem to expire/getting burnt out symultanously.

[Z]

That's great that it worked out for you so far.  I appreciate the credit, but the only thing I did was vaguely remember a thread from the phile.

I have never actually taken subs.  It is sort of newer here in Canada.  Plus I've taken methadone for so long that the thought of pwd from it scares the crap out of me.  I stumbled across the microdosing when I thought about switching and filed it away for later use.  I'm glad that you're getting some use out of it now!

[Esoteric Anhydride (OP)]

I got the second dose down this morning ok. Most of the morning I've felt a bit unsettled though, not sure exactly why -- it could be the slow transition, could be the shitty dope I'm doing, could be stress from current living situation which is chaotic; could be all of, or even none of the above. When I took the dose, I can't say I noticed anything that felt like a wd initiation, but it was indeed a very small amount of bup, like maybe half-a-.177-bb sized.

I've considered digging around like maybe the wayback machine (internet archives) for that old thread, I'd be interested in reading it if it's at all available.

But anyway ya, so far so good it seems. Again this idea makes a lot of sense to me, hopefully it works as well in practice as it seems it should.. Gonna find out!