Seconal Sodium (Secobarbital Sodium)

[mousekewitz (OP)]

To make a long story short, I have refractory insomnia and my doc put me on Halcion (Triazolam) but I suffered severe side effects from it and and had to quit taking it after only 5 nights; so, my doc put me on Seconal Sodium (Secobarbital Sodium) - one 100mg capsule at bedtime  - as an option of last resort - apparently the last time my doc remembered having written a prescription for these for a person was around 1990.

Getting the Rx for this med filled was an adventure in it's self - no pharmacy had it in stock and they all said they couldn't order it - so I eventually got referred to a pharmacy located inside a hospital and they agreed to filled the script. Anyways, this Rx went through my insurance (medicaid) without a problem - no prior authorization required! - and I got my prescription bottle of thirty of these small reddish-orange capsules.

Anyways, this med is excellent for sleep - they aren't oppressively sedative at all (I can stay awake all night after taking one of these without a problem so long as I don't go to bed except I get a groggily and hungover feeling when they wear off) and they take about 45 to 90 minutes to have effect (at least for me) and they just gently relax and nudge you to sleep (it feels all very natural for me). I wake up refreshed with no groggily or hungover feeling and with my memory full intact. Seconal is an excellent sleep med and superior to all the benzo-type sleep meds out there in my opinion - it's a shame doctors don't prescribe this for sleep much these days.

That all being said, this med doesn't give me much of a head or body high and I don't personally feel that it has all that much recreational value at all. This med feels much weaker than Halcion (Triazolam) let alone Xanax (Alprazolam). Don't get me wrong, I feel very lucky and privileged to have an Rx for this medication because even if it doesn't live up to it's hype it nevertheless is an awesome sleep med that works for me and allows me to get a full night's rest without any side effects.

So, in my experience and opinion, I'd say Seconal Sodium (Secobarbital Sodium) is excellent for sleep but not really much else.

Anyone else have any experiences with this med ?

[radioactive_man]

No personal experience here.

With that being said, I'd love to try it IV.

I'm glad to hear it helps with your sleep. That's a rare thing when one finds a good sleep aid.

Beware of tolerance.

Also, welcome to the forum man. I hope you stick around.

[Chip]

wiki says:

After the rights to Seconal were sold to Valeant Pharmaceuticals in 2015, Valeant immediately doubled the price in the United States from $1,500 per 100 capsules to $3,000.

... is that affordable ?

[Edhorfin]

I’m old. In 1972, I shoplifted a full bottle of Seconal from a pharmacy shelf. Back then, they had openings on either side of the tall counter for staff to pass. They stocked the Seconal on a side shelf within reach of the pass through.

I was in high school at the time, working a retail job with a buddy. We were working 1 pm to closing, at 9 pm. Dinner break at 4 pm.

We left for dinner and that’s when the reds were discovered. By 5 pm we each had taken 2. By 6 pm the dept mgr of my buddies area called over for me to come check on my friend. He was asleep on a stool drooling with his pants tucked in to his socks. No idea why. Had to call another friend to cart him off.

Fun times.

You can die pretty easily on any of the true barbiturates, esp. when combined with alcohol. I think that was how Marilyn Monroe bought it.

That bottle of 100 reds lasted a while. Tuinal, a combo a Seconal and amonarbital were even more fun. Faster acting, if memory serves. Thanks Eli Lilly.

[mousekewitz (OP)]

wiki says:

After the rights to Seconal were sold to Valeant Pharmaceuticals in 2015, Valeant immediately doubled the price in the United States from $1,500 per 100 capsules to $3,000.

... is that affordable ?

I live in a state that has a really good medicaid program (government-funded and operated joint Federal-State health insurance program) that covers prescription drugs without any co-pays or deductibles - however, your income has to below a certain level to be eligible for it. I paid $0 for the Seconal.

[mousekewitz (OP)]

No personal experience here.

With that being said, I'd love to try it IV.

I'm glad to hear it helps with your sleep. That's a rare thing when one finds a good sleep aid.

Beware of tolerance.

Also, welcome to the forum man. I hope you stick around.

Thanks for the welcome. Also, the tolerance thing - I've been taking these for about a month and a half and I've been lucky so far with respect to tolerance.

[mousekewitz (OP)]

I’m old. In 1972, I shoplifted a full bottle of Seconal from a pharmacy shelf. Back then, they had openings on either side of the tall counter for staff to pass. They stocked the Seconal on a side shelf within reach of the pass through.

I was in high school at the time, working a retail job with a buddy. We were working 1 pm to closing, at 9 pm. Dinner break at 4 pm.

We left for dinner and that’s when the reds were discovered. By 5 pm we each had taken 2. By 6 pm the dept mgr of my buddies area called over for me to come check on my friend. He was asleep on a stool drooling with his pants tucked in to his socks. No idea why. Had to call another friend to cart him off.

Fun times.

You can die pretty easily on any of the true barbiturates, esp. when combined with alcohol. I think that was how Marilyn Monroe bought it.

That bottle of 100 reds lasted a while. Tuinal, a combo of Seconal (Secobarbital) and Amytal (Amobarbital) were even more fun. Faster acting, if memory serves. Thanks Eli Lilly.

Awesome story, I love hearing about how things were back in the day when the true barbs were more common place. 

As for the dangers of mixing barbiturates and alcohol - I'm well aware of such and don't do such - but nevertheless I definitely appreciate you bringing that up.

As for Tuinal, they stopped making the 50mg and 200mg capsules some time ago and were only making the 100mg ones as of a few years ago and now they've stopped making Tuinal altogether unfortunately. RIP Tuinal.

[zachleez]

i am happy to reply to your post, i to had horrible insomnia i went thru every drug literally

finally ended up at halcion after that we went to Seconal, nobody would fill it finally found a walgreens that would, many of the staff actually laughed and said they hadnt seen it since 1980s

he only have it to me for 3 months and stopped saying it could be dangerous and addictive, then i went on to take xyrem (ghb)

are you still RX? i loved them

[Chip]

trust me, you can't beat Sodium Oxabate (GHB) for intractable insomnia.

the w/d from Seconal can be severe.

seriously friend, if you can score Seconal then it's going to get ugly.

Barbs will lose their efficacy and leave you with a dangerous habit.

get Sodium Oxabate and enjoy !

EDIT: oh i see, Zyrem is the same thing. Good for you.

are you still using it ?

[Edhorfin]

yup. 1973.  I was 17 years old.I was working in a mall. Dinner break, about 5pm. The mall had a drugstore, with a tall counter at the front of the pharmacy, with openings on each side for staff to pass. Not a full length counter, with a gate or anything, just an opening on either side with two steps up to behind the counter.

Walls of shelves containing big bottles of drugs. I spied there, on a side shelf, on the wall beside the opening, a big bottle of Seconal. No one was looking, so I shoplifted it. Full bottle of (i think) Lilly brand 100 mg seconals.

Me and my bud popped two each and went back to work in the department store. He was in shipping, I was selling in the men's department. I got a call from another guy in shipping, telling me to come on up and check on my bud, cuz he wasn't coherent.

Upon arrival in shipping, I see my bud sitting on a tall stool, hat on backwards, pants tucked in to his socks. No idea why..Drooling...about 50% conscious....I told his suoervisor he had taken antibiotics for a case of the clap and had a beer with dinner. No problem.

My bud was rich and had a perfect Boss 302 Mustang. Had to call another friend to drive him out of there and home.

We had lots of fun with those reds......How no one died is beyond me....

[Esoteric Anhydride]

I actually found GHB to be not so great for sleep. It would get me there, but I wake up after 3-4hrs and have to re-dose, so I was always up high on G in the middle of the night for a bit. Also, the quality of sleep wasn't great. It's like alcohol sleep, you're out, but it's not rejuvenative.

GHB is nice, but xyrem for sleep left me unimpressed.

[Chip]

@Esoteric Anhydride, yeah that's the deal with Xyrem; you have to wake up to redose.

waking up high on G, man could i live with that 

but it can't be any worse than a fent habit where you're up every 2 hours or whatever.

did you not feel well rested even after just 4 hours ?

maybe you didn't take enough ?

Xyrem is GHB, from what i know.

[dillydudeEL14]

Welcome!  And I must say im super jealous that you got seconal.  im sure your condition sucks, but I just have an obsession with the old true barbs and ive never had them.  I have had phenobarb, but that's a long acting and not all that great although I preferred it over benzos.  I know from what ive read that its really nothing special, but I cant help it I REALLY wanna try seconal as that's the only true old fashioned barb that's still available. Nembutal and tui are all gone iirc.  I just wanna see those red capsules, I love how they still look the same as they have for like 50 years or whatever. 

I have read that, like your situation, it is possible to get them if youre willing to spend a long time trying alternative treatments and jumping thru hoops, but idk if I could do it anyway as my pain doctor is pretty adamant about not mixing benzos(and I would assume he feels the same about barbs) with opiates, and I could not and would not give up my precious dilaudid for anything non opiate lol.  I may try telling him I have trouble sleeping and that I am going to seek treatment for it and see what he says, I actually enjoy putting in the work of jumping thru the hoops and doing what is necessary to get the script of my choice, lol its like a sick little game and I feel really accomplished when I finally score haha.

  But I just will have to make absolutely crystal clear that if I have to choose one or the other I will stay on my opiates and do without sedatives.  I do have difficulty sleeping and from what everyone has said it seems to be amazing for sleep and no hangover or bullshit to deal with.  Maybe someday!!

[bignasty]

I thought the 100mg phenobarbitals sucked. I could feel a slight downer effect but it wasn't very calming, relaxing or sleep inducing whatsoever.
I've also had butalbital and thought it sucked as well. It worked for headaches sometimes but couldn't really feel any kinda sedative effect even if I took 5 or 6 Fioricets. I imagine I never felt the butalbital 'cause of the caffeine in Fioricet working against the sedative effects of the barb.
I'd give my left nut to try some Tuinals which have the combo of barbs in it IIRC. Also, I would love to try IV amytal/amobarbital or pentobarbital or REALLY love some IV thiopental AKA truth serum AKA sodium pentothal.

If I could do it all over, I'd go to med school to become a MD just so I could script myself or a friend willing to share or willing to pick up for me some liquid IV high-dose dilaudid, IV midazolam and IV sodium pentothal and IV diprivan/propofol, desoxyn pills, IV liquid morphine, IM testosterone cypionate/proprionate, IV demerol, IV numorphan/oxymorphone, IV oxycodone, IV fentanyl, IV ketamine, IV pharm cocaine, bulk pharm grade cocaine powder, bulk pharm grade hydromorphone and oxymorphone powder, and most importantly a SHITLOAD of IV narcan in case my combo opioid/barb/benzo/coke/diprivan/meth/ketamine shots go wrong which they inevitably will if I have/had access to all of the above.

Wake up with a shot of IV coke, IV numorphan, IV dilaudid, IV fent and IV versed.
Go to sleep with a shot of IV Versed, IV Demerol, IV dilaudid, IV fent, IV phenergan and tiny dose of IV diprivan with a PCA pump of dilaudid, fent, versed, phenergan and a TINY amount of propofol. 
Middle of the night, high dose shot of IV Demerol and 25mg's of IV Phenergan. That should keep me asleep thru the short half lives of the PCA pump meds.

EDIT: I forgot IV promethazine as I'd do big shots that would cause nausea and it's almost impossible to fight sleep when given 25-50 mg's of IV Phenergan.

[Chip]

... or be a brilliant chemist for personal synths only !