Switching for a bupe-first round lost

[nikita70 (OP)]

@Daughter of Dionysus

Since this fucking shrink has made my life unbearable (I think, I must have been told about it more than one can bear)
and wanted me to go to the detox to get off benzos (he sure is gonna prescribe me tons of these shitty deadeners/brainfuckers instead-he's really good in it) OR deny my take homes completely,
what is a real drudgery, completely inacceptable to me, and it'd turn my life into a one big mess.
I can't do much as my hands are tied for an obvious reason, but I'm going to do my best (or worst)
not to let this scum get away with it-even if it means nothing but just my own satisfaction not to crap out in what I decided.
I said my way or highway dude, cos I'm playing this fucking game so long I'm practically PhD of narcology, and definitely too long to let
one ignorant dumbass tell me what is good and what isn't to me.
I was trying to explain him my relationship with drugs ('done) is exactly as personal as the bonds of love&sex used to be ,
I mean I'm that one who decide where, when, how long, how big, and how much,
you know, one day I have whim to do it once but to the hilt, so to say (like until I'm getting a nod)
another one twice, but gentle, or with two different strangers (like to come with a subtle glow)   
there's nothing in it what could be schedulded in any form or so,
it's how it works, sex and drugs and rock'n'roll,
so do me a favor and get the fuck of my bedroom, so to say .
So now I'm struggling with making decision to start switching for a bupe.
Though I remember it being not any big deal last time I did it,for some reason since over 2 months I'm postponing being like
"today is a PERFECT  day to start transition, but my higher self tells me that TOMORROW is going to be
way way better. I'd bet I can feel it in my guts." You know this old worn routine.
Well, apparently I have NO GUTS enough to do it.
I make my first attempt yesterday, after my partner said it's the highest time.
It was completely disaster. I still can feel the "flashbacks" today. Not sure what was going wrong.
Started feeling a little bit sick already, yawning, sneezing, and craving and all,
as I was working on my PC, occasionally taking a briefly but greedy looks alternately, at my poor methadone' stash and these fucking pills I didn't trust to,
without being able to decide what should I do.
Finally considered my feeling to be "bad enough" to take a risk and enter the experiment.
Well, apparently it wasn't "bad enough".
'cos about 15 minutes after the pills got absorbed in my mouth I found myself feeling kinda oddly, unpleasant uptight,
my heart started beating faster, the w/d symptoms seemed not only not to be reduced but even to improve/increase...wtf?
I expected this nice rush and excitement, the same one I always appreciate so much with a bupe,
and an opiate' relief and what I was given instead? 
As I looked into a mirror and saw my eyes wide open and pupils as dilated as I'd worn some vampire' like lenses,
I realized "things are fucking far from OK" and started freaking out as hell.
My bf told me there's no reason to fall into panic, he was kinda the same way short after he did them and now it's SURVIVABLE (LOL),
it's an acute, bothersome but transient reaction for a switch, and tends to get stable
"just take some fresh air, you're going to be ok soon", he said.
I don't know what has posessed me, but I entered the next door bar and ordered a drink,
instead of some fresh air,
the stupidest idea ever,
in kinda futile hope to imitate/follow the usual, daily habit might be helpful.
It wasn't, and after the first sip of drink I realized I'm sick and horrendous craving-maybe even more than sick.
I was looking forward this unique combaining of warmth, glow, sense of safety and nice-tasting paralysing that opiates+vodka provides you with.
But it wasn't there. As if alcohol "didn't answer" the call of opiates, or the other way. 
I "rinsed" an alcohol with a modest sip of the 'done (thank God I was smart enough to have it by my hand,I was about to run out of,though, so I'd prefer not to split/part with so stupid way),
I felt full of disgust and beating myself for I "cracked at it".
I got back home and got my partner's haid upside for what he told to me.
Methadone seemed "not to pick up the call", still. Fucking oddly, felt as if I were under some bad (or good) spell,
insisting to save my soul.
Things putting altogether has definitely driven me completely mad. I got some mild blackout so I hardly remember this evening, excepting I have shaved
my eyebrows with a blunt razor...(well, I never liked them, but not sure what wrong "drawn" eyebrows have to do with
some dumbass' doc ignorance-apparently the both things must have something common;))
plus     
that I was in one
of my murderous moods (well, maybe the shaving was kinda unawared referance to the movie "TaxiDriver" or "The Wall"...).
I have no clue about alcohol&cocaine/stims, but it's how I figure myself the "worst edition of it ever".
I barely remember as I was raving like "I wish I would live in Russia or US or wherever carrying weapon and handling a gun is pretty common...I'd be gathering few guys,
paying them generous and we'd blow this fucker's (doc) head away together, obviously after having some long, thoroughly, nice chat with him
to straighten him a little before he's biting a dust..." LOL
(definitely too much Tarantino's)
Still can feel this fucking antiagonists fighting my methadone. Such a waste, as I'm about to run out.

...looks I'm in some real troubles
I need to make it, one way or another unless I'd be fucked up.   
   
 
   

[Dog Food]

Methadone to subs is a terrible idea.  You gotta wait like 5+ days after tapering off the done to start the subs.  Precipitated withdrawals are the worst feeling ive ever felt, and i have even shot a sub too soon and theres no way to describe how bad and how quick i went from kinda starting to get dopesick to the worst pain ive ever experienced in my life in like 5 seconds.   Like an ANTI-heroin rush is how i describe iv subs too early.

[dizzle]

oh sweetie.


oh my.


yeah. you pretty much put yourself into PWD there. PWD's with bupe are weird, they're not the same PWD's as I've gotten from full antagonists, like naloxone. For me, I IV'ed like 4mg's of bupe at about 18 hours off of heroin, and, i immediately knew something was VERY WRONG. Felt like ICE over my body, looked in mirror and saw that vampire effect you mentioned. Funniest part was, I was at work at the time. I used to install car stereo/security systems and almost alwasy was by myself all day, so thankfully no one was around.

I fucking FREAKED out. like got a shitload of energy and couldn't sit still. mentally I was just churning over and over the thought of how to get dope in me and make it stop. NOW. I ran into the parking garage and went towards my car, sitting in it, I had the thought that I didn't even have any money so it didn't matter it I went to the hood. I paniced, I was a very weird temperaure, I'd call it a cold sweat, clammy skin with just dampness enveloping my entire body. All my muscles and brain receptors screamed at me to help them, feed them, they were STARVING for opiates.


So, long story short, you sent yourself into PWD, with bupe it usually (USUALLY!) isn't absolute insanity, you're probably not going to be projectile vomiting and shitting at the same time, but you're going to FEEL mentally like you are. As is my experience with bupe, it handles the PHYSICAL ASPECT ONLY, and only handles the most extreme symptoms, the mental aspect of WD/PWD is basically unchanged, and you have to deal with it, which is AWFUL.

[Dog Food]

If anyone ever does get pwd's ,  (dont od) take your maximum dose of your opiate of choice, and it will at least make you comfortable. I usually need like 3x as much to actually get high after taking a lil sub too early. 

(And fyi- dont EVER shoot sub on the first day on it without taking it under your tongue first, then you can iv it on the second day)

[nikita70 (OP)]

So, long story short, you sent yourself into PWD, with bupe it usually (USUALLY!) isn't absolute insanity, you're probably not going to be projectile vomiting and shitting at the same time, but you're going to FEEL mentally like you are. As is my experience with bupe, it handles the PHYSICAL ASPECT ONLY, and only handles the most extreme symptoms, the mental aspect of WD/PWD is basically unchanged, and you have to deal with it, which is AWFUL.

@dizzle

Yeah, absolutely, that's my case what you have described.
You hit the nail to the head, it would be hard to convey the point more precisely.
Definitely one of the weirdest and unplesant experiences I ever went through.
I wouldn't even get into the simple, usual juxtaposition "mild w/d" versus "acute w/d"-it seems not to be working for this case at all
as if it wouldn't be able to deal with all aspects of it.
I'd rather call it "selectively" or "specifically" withdrawal symptoms, what tastes even stranger.
It's like "my body doesn't hurt, my thoughts are perfectly clear-painful clear, could be said, I'm getting "social" and talkative as hell within literally few minutes, I'm overloaded with some sick sort of energy,
still, there's something wrong. There's a MISSING LINK in my body and mind and it's unbearable."
What I consider to be crucial for a bupe PWD is that no matter how hard we'd try to prepare ourselves for the coming up inconvenience and convince ourselves
that THIS TIME it'll be something else what is going to happen soon,
we are in fact kinda psycho-somatically disabled STOP/NOT TO LOOK FORWARD THE PROPER OPIATE FLASH as we're using (doing whatever),
on some very basically, cellular/molecular level.
We tend to find ourselves feeling disappointed and "inaccomplished" if the dope is just not as perfectly "kickassed" as it used to be,
not even to mention something nearly opposite.
(@Dog Food, "ANTI-heroin flash", that's some really good point!!!)

I mean, I CAN'T just put my receptors shit like
"hey guys, I'm really sorry having such bad news to you,
but the next shot/dose you are missing so much and look forward...
well, it'll be... um, something else comparing to what you guys are used to/accustomed to.
I mean it probably doesn't bring any result.
Might happen, it'll make you feel even worse than before but
PLEASE BE BRAVE AND PATIENT, COS IT'S JUST TEMPORARY and things gettin straight soon enough, again.
Deal?"

What misled me so mean, were my previous successfull attempt about 10 years before,
as things has "clicked" surprisingly easy (ok, relatively easy not to idealize a thing) at the first sting, so to say,
I wonder how 0,8 mg (!!!) of bupe was able to fix me pretty well the first day, after barely 24 hours of staying off methadone.
Still, I have somehow ignored the psychological aspect of how strong motivated I was those times,
plus that I have tapered down to 15mgs before I even put myself to switch,
as this time Im on 25mgs (or even more) plus
the transition is in many ways enforced by some really scandalous, outrageous blackmailing I was exposed for (like "your benzos or your methadone")
therefore carrying of this process is going to entail inevitable sense frustration, embittering, anger and "quest for revenge"
(like to show this fucker how ridiculous, pointless and idle his fanatical, overzealous attitude gets, "my way or highway, even if some pain needs to be involved").

Needless to tell such a stigma doesn't favor the whole undertaking. 

 

[Chip]

{snip}
plus that I have tapered down to 15mgs before I even put myself to switch,
as this time Im on 25mgs (or even more)
{snip}

i say that dizzle is right, even 15 mg. sounds too high - somebody just plucks these numbers out of the air, not to mention your increased "mileage" now - it really matters. I am struggling with 2.5 mg MD drops now where once, even at this low dose, they were not a big problem way back during my earlier tapers.

i am on 20 mg. slow MD detox and when my doctor and i discussed Bupe transitioning, he told me not to bother and stay on the 'done.

Bupe's PWD scares the crap out of me ... *shudder*