Questions About MMT and Other Treatment Options

[THC815 (OP)]

Hey community,

So here's my spiel before I get to asking questions/advice. I have some sort of horribly messed up back and have had it for awhile. No doctor has really ever diagnosed the issue nor ever prescribed me any painkillers in any of my many visits through this process. So, almost 2.5 years ago the pain began to become unbearable and I had to take matters into my own hands. I started by self medicating on any Vicodin I could get on the streets, but after a short time with money and various hookups running dry I switched over to heroin. Now I had done it before for a short run prior to this injury l, I didn't jump right in. Things were going alright for the most part, but of course I fell in the hole. Now 1 OD later, my problem being realized amongst family, finally being in the throws of horrible withdrawals and just general desire to better myself I have come to the realization I can't do this forever and I need to pick myself up and get this figured out.

So now one of the main issues is kicking this habit. I have no desire to enter an in patient facility as I feel my issues are somewhat unfixable in that environment, expense, and I've just seen too many friends/people do the 30 days and come out with no progress. I've been browsing reading material on MMT and mainly curious what people's experience has been like on this treatment plan? Google states it's a painkiller so is it similar to Vicodin and that's why it's used to taper people off? What are programs and the process usually like? How long can you stay within and MMT program usually? I figure if it relieves pain and helps me quit dope, if no doctor will prescribe me anything help, maybe methadone can at least help me get to the gym/physical therapy. Helping my pain from there while I learn to taper off opiates. I've also read it can be addicting and it becomes its own habit as well, so I'd love to hear stories about that.

Also reading on here and other places I've come across people mentioning bupe or transitions from MMT to bupe. However it commonly seems to be horror stories and I can't seem to find any information on its effects/and purpose besides it being a partial antagonist and helping with opioid addiction. So why is it so horrible? Also curious about suboxone as the seemed to be the main treatment back home amongst people I know. Though I've heard it sucks many times. Not in a horror sounding way as bupe, but more along the lines of it not helping or doing anything.

Once again, any help, info, or advice in this time of transition for me would be wonderful. Thanks!

[Esoteric Anhydride]

If you think wd is horrible now, it's nothing compared to the jones you'll have after 6mos. on methadone. To say it "can" be addictive is a ridiculous understatement.

Methadone should not be a first choice for pain control. Pain management and Methadone Maintenance are two *totally* separate things, nobody should be going to a klinik for pain control, that's not how they're set up.

[Dopeless Hopefiend]

If you think wd is horrible now, it's nothing compared to the jones you'll have after 6mos. on methadone. To say it "can" be addictive is a ridiculous understatement.

Methadone should not be a first choice for pain control. Pain management and Methadone Maintenance are two *totally* separate things, nobody should be going to a klinik for pain control, that's not how they're set up.

This. One hundred fucking times this.

[DeadCat]

Doctors, especiallly pain specialists and "palliative care" specialist do prescribe methodone for pain. Signing up for a methodone clinic is done when you are at a point when your opioate use is out of control and wrecking your life. It doesn't sound like you are at that point.

Have you seen a pain specialist? It sounds liek that is what you need more than opiates per se. There may be other treatements better suited to your specific case.

If you haven't, ask yout primary care physician for a referral for an apppointemtn with a specialist and son't be shy about asking for a second opinion after that if you don't get relief from your pain. Opiates may be the answer but they come with strings attached, always.

[bignasty]

Also reading on here and other places I've come across people mentioning bupe or transitions from MMT to bupe. However it commonly seems to be horror stories and I can't seem to find any information on its effects/and purpose besides it being a partial antagonist and helping with opioid addiction. So why is it so horrible? Also curious about suboxone as the seemed to be the main treatment back home amongst people I know. Though I've heard it sucks many times. Not in a horror sounding way as bupe, but more along the lines of it not helping or doing anything.

Suboxone is bupe+naloxone. Bupe is suboxone. They're the same thing.

As you're already doing H, if you can't get any help from doctors and are in excruciating pain, I'd recommend going to a 'done clinic for your pain. I recommend going to a pain doctor first but if that doesn't work, you have no other option besides doing H and that's already caused you 1 OD.

MMT is not designed for pain management but there are a lot of people at 'done clinics that are there because they simply can't get adequate pain control or any pain control from their doctors, OR they're sick of the bullshit that comes with pain clinics and it's easier for them to go to the clinic and get a hefty dose of 'done to help their pain. Not ideal but better than struggling with pain and/or H addiction and/or overdoses.

[LadyKalma]

I would go with methadone over suboxone hands down. If my state didn't test for weed I'd be on the clinic, but at this time I can't deal with quitting weed or never getting takehomes.

Quitting methadone ideally should be done slow as hell, 1 mg at a time. People who have bad withdrawals from it usually are kicked off the clinic for whatever reason and can't taper properly. Never plan to go cold turkey off mantinence meds. That's a good way to relapse when you can't handle one more day of the misery.

[bignasty]

I would go with methadone over suboxone hands down. If my state didn't test for weed I'd be on the clinic, but at this time I can't deal with quitting weed or never getting takehomes.

Quitting methadone ideally should be done slow as hell, 1 mg at a time. People who have bad withdrawals from it usually are kicked off the clinic for whatever reason and can't taper properly. Never plan to go cold turkey off mantinence meds. That's a good way to relapse when you can't handle one more day of the misery.

LOL, I feel u on the quitting weed or never getting take-homes conundrum. I went to 'done clinics on and off (mostly on) for 5 yrs before I got a single take-home besides holiday or Sunday take-homes (which I only got in one state/clinic, other 2 were open on Sunday) 'cause of weed. It's stupid they even test for weed when you're going there to stop injecting heroin or pills most of the time. I mean they should use a little common sense and realize that weed isn't a big concern when dealing with IV dope users.

I can understand them testing for other "hard" drugs or other drugs that will have a bad reaction when mixed with 'done but testing for weed at the beginning of your treatment is retarded IMO. I could even understand them testing for weed if you're trying to get more than a week's worth of take-homes or something like that since they're trying to get you away from wanting to use drugs to get high and trying to get you away from "the life" where you're buying illegal drugs from dealers and shit. But if you say "I'm okay with only getting a week's worth at a time", they should say "OK, we won't punish you or take away your take-homes for marijuana but we really encourage you to stop smoking and we'll let you get more take-homes as soon as you test negative for THC" or something like that.

Also, you're correct about not quitting abruptly. I went from getting 120mg's a day from the clinic and 40mg's a day from my doctor to cut off from both of them. Was sick of the bullshit so started taking suboxone literally 2-4 days after taking my last dose of 320mg's of 'done. Dopesick or PWDs doesn't even begin to describe what I went through for 10-15 days while the sub and 'done fought it out for opiate receptors inside my body. Had I had access to good dope and the money to buy plenty, I probably would've OD'd from doing 1-2 gram shots 'cause I felt SOOO bad. Worst decision of my life to start sub like that but once I had gone through a day of feeling like shit, I was too hard headed to give up and go buy 'done (or any good opiates) off the street which I could have easily done.

Lastly, there's a guy at my clinic that I talk to regularly that's tapered down by going down 5mg's every 2 weeks and he's gone from 180mg's a day down to 45mg's a day last time I talked to him. He said he does the 5mg drops on Friday's so he'll feel bad on Friday, Saturday and Sunday. Then, he feels fine when he goes to work on Monday.

Personally, I'd rather go down 1mg every 3-4 days OR 2.5mg's every week than 5mg's all at once every 2 weeks but whatever works for you/him. If you taper somewhat slowly, it's mostly mental if you feel bad or have WD symptoms. If I ever decide to taper from 'done, I'm going to ask my doctor for some Tylenol 4's (60mg's of codeine each) or 10mg hydrocodone's for if I feel shitty and am tempted to go get dope 2-4 days after they reduce my dose and I'm below 30-40mg's of 'done so I can actually feel codeine or hydrocodone if I need to take it.