Apology

[Narkotikon (OP)]

Nark I don't think that you should be giving out positive or negative rep if you are choosing to not participate in it yourself. If you are going to be using features that the rest of us don't have access to, it doesn't seem right to dole out points.

That's fair.  I promise not to give out rep, positive or negative, until this gets resolved permanently.

While I think me not giving out rep when I'm not participating doesn't apply to positive rep, it does to negative.  It would be okay for me to give a positive"gift" while not being comfortable receiving one, but that doesn't apply to negative "gifts" / points.  If I'm not willing to receive negative points, it shouldn't be okay for me to give them out.  I agree.

To keep peace, I won't give out positive or negative points until this gets resolved. 

[Morfy]

@ Nark:
Christian What??

@ Everyone:
Maybe, in all seriousness, make the SMITE button be worth [-0.25], or a negative quarter point.  So that it would take 4, Smites to counter-act, or cancel 1, Positive rep.

Or maybe make the Smite worth one-third [-0.33], or one-tenth [-0.1].

Another good system is to have the Positive & Negative points separated and kept track of.  So the Positives are stand-alone, and cannot be affected by the Negative Smite points, and Vice-Versa.

[Narkotikon (OP)]

Morphy: The overall message, not really the name of the deities.  Stuff like the meek will inherit, standing on the Rock of Redemption, the mention of good works, etc.  Those are all Christian / biblical references if I'm not mistaken.

I enjoyed your use of those through the lens of paganism (use of a multi-headed, multi-armed Hindu god, the use of Vatinoso, whichever deity that is).

[Morfy]

Morphy: The overall message, not really the name of the deities.  Stuff like the meek will inherit, standing on the Rock of Redemption, the mention of good works, etc.  Those are all Christian / biblical references if I'm not mistaken.

I enjoyed your use of those through the lens of paganism (use of a multi-headed, multi-armed Hindu god, the use of Vatinoso, whichever deity that is).

Narky, I was teasing with you--sorry, I can take things too far.  I was under the influence of PST, which may explain my actions, but certainly doesn't excuse them!

THere was even some lyrics from an Old U2 Song (Forty) in the original as well!  (strong Christian imagery--miry clay, redemption, etc...)  you caught it!

I gave you an Applause Point for me being a jerk (how long will this applause last???)

Cheers

[Narkotikon (OP)]

It's all good.  You weren't being a jerk.  Sometimes I take things too literally when I read them.  So your subtle joke just went over my head.   

If anything, you're more of a jerk b/c you gave me a point and I now have to delete it.  LOL.  Sorry, just a bad joke.  You're really not a jerk.

[Chip]

I liked the "other" rep system as you could see who its from and the reason for it. If I were to get neg rep here then how would I know what I had done to upset anyone?

we can simply ask people to mail you ? as i said, next week i will explore our options.

we are so keen to keep our peers happy, we need a system that won't be abused, if we have one at all.

i can turn it off with one click but for now, it's under review.

[monkawat]

If you guys choose to retain the karma system is there a way to let us see who posted what? It seems pretty lame that people can hide behind their keyboards and anonymously "smite" (lol at choice of term for the negative karmic action)  or "applaud" their fellow members. Either way, I hope you all figure out a way for folks to opt out.

I liked how the phile only allowed positive rep actions but I didn't care for the anonymity aspect of things. Why not let us see what other individuals on here think about us? Gives you some insight as far as how you are acting and how you are being received and how you can ultimately rectify the situation if you so desire.
 

[Taytoechip]

If you guys choose to retain the karma system is there a way to let us see who posted what? It seems pretty lame that people can hide behind their keyboards and anonymously "smite" (lol at choice of term for the negative karmic action)  or "applaud" their fellow members. Either way, I hope you all figure out a way for folks to opt out.

I liked how the phile only allowed positive rep actions but I didn't care for the anonymity aspect of things. Why not let us see what other individuals on here think about us? Gives you some insight as far as how you are acting and how you are being received and how you can ultimately rectify the situation if you so desire.

the phile also had a neutral rating option too i believe?

[Narkotikon (OP)]

I liked how the phile only allowed positive rep actions but I didn't care for the anonymity aspect of things. Why not let us see what other individuals on here think about us? Gives you some insight as far as how you are acting and how you are being received and how you can ultimately rectify the situation if you so desire.
 

You had to pay for that privilege, er, I mean right.   

I agree though, it should be made public...who's giving out what.  It's really kinda pointless to give out points and not know who, what, why, etc.  You have no idea how to change if you want to.  I think it would also decrease abuse.  People might not be so brazen about smiting others if they know their name is on it.  As things are now, I think some think its a game.  Gratuitous smiting is the new sporting rage apparently.       People on this board should be better than that, as this board is trying to be better than Opiophile regarding that type of behavior. 

[monkawat]

Nark I don't feel that it was fair that you were choosing "not to participate" in the karma system when the rest of us didn't have a choice and had to retain our negative reputation points (that other members obviously felt we deserved just like the positive ones we received) when Chipper chose to implement the Positive-Negative deal as this guaranteed that you would end up without negative karma points while the rest of us had to deal with our actual karma score. I know were upset that you were being given a lot of negative points but the rest of us got some too and I saw some people who had more neg than positive (Jega comes to mind); so it was spread around a lot. You were the only mod I saw doing this- were you the only one though?

It's not some crazy big deal- I for one don't support any kind of karma system at this point despite my current overall positive score because it detracts from the true purpose of the forum IMO; but I don't think that type of behavior necessarily aligns with the way chipper has described and continues to describe this board as, since you were using your special status as an admin to perform an action the rest of us weren't entitled to, simply because you didn't like how other people were posting on your karma score. Others didn't like it either but we didn't have that special option. Obviously mods are always granted more privileges out of necessity on a forum but I just thought that wasn't the right thing to do, especially since later you chose to only remove negative points while retaining your positive points. If you were choosing "not to participate"- why didn't you end up removing it all so you'd end up with a straight zero after chipper changed everything?

Just food for thought, no hard feelings man. You said it was being abused- how so? And if you did clear everything before the change- please let me know so I can retract part of what I've said here. I only wanted to say this because of the effect it had when chip changed the system to the deduction type deal so sorry for being late to the party, so to speak.

[St. Theresa]

There's all different types of rep systems, on one forum I'm a member of we have "thanks", and it gives the members name and the time/date of the thanks given, no negativity.

I can see why some people would want the smite thing gone. Who wants to smited?

Nark you're a good egg. 

[Sand and Water]

Hi Monk--  I don't want to derail your questions to Nark. But in case other members are wondering, I can only speak for myself, but no, I never changed or deleted my karma points in any way.

ETA: to my knowledge no other mods/admin have done that.

[monkawat]

There's all different types of rep systems, on one forum I'm a member of we have "thanks", and it gives the members name and the time/date of the thanks given, no negativity.

I can see why some people would want the smite thing gone. Who wants to smited?

Nark you're a good egg.

I don't think he's necessarily a bad person: I just didn't think it was a fair move at all considering the way Chip has been emphasizing the way this site differs in relation to mods and their interactions with the normal membership/not doing stuff that we can't just cuz something annoys them. It annoyed me when I got a negative point but I wasn't allowed to remove my point while keeping my positive.

I would have liked to have chosen to "not participate" in the rep system either but I couldn't since I wasn't a mod/granted that special ability. I didn't see Chip, the head of the whole board doing this, Sand and water, or Chops either so that's why I wanted to bring it up post-rep-change.

[Jega]

I don't think he's necessarily a bad person: I just didn't think it was a fair move at all considering the way Chip has been emphasizing the way this site differs in relation to mods and their interactions with the normal membership/not doing stuff that we can't just cuz something annoys them.

Ya but dude...shit's been delt with. Let it die.

It annoyed me when I got a negative point but I wasn't allowed to remove my point while keeping my positive.

tough shits

I would have liked to have chosen to "not participate" in the rep system either but I couldn't since I wasn't a mod/granted that special ability. I didn't see Chip, the head of the whole board doing this, Sand and water, or Chops either so that's why I wanted to bring it up post-rep-change.

So the way I read that is unless you get to be a mod, you don't want to do it. So...Good Luck with that!


Hey on another topic, I like this system for now. It's perfect no, but very good.

[Narkotikon (OP)]

Nark I don't feel that it was fair that you were choosing "not to participate" in the karma system when the rest of us didn't have a choice and had to retain our negative reputation points (that other members obviously felt we deserved just like the positive ones we received) when Chipper chose to implement the Positive-Negative deal as this guaranteed that you would end up without negative karma points while the rest of us had to deal with our actual karma score. I know were upset that you were being given a lot of negative points but the rest of us got some too and I saw some people who had more neg than positive (Jega comes to mind); so it was spread around a lot. You were the only mod I saw doing this- were you the only one though?

It's not some crazy big deal- I for one don't support any kind of karma system at this point despite my current overall positive score because it detracts from the true purpose of the forum IMO; but I don't think that type of behavior necessarily aligns with the way chipper has described and continues to describe this board as, since you were using your special status as an admin to perform an action the rest of us weren't entitled to, simply because you didn't like how other people were posting on your karma score. Others didn't like it either but we didn't have that special option. Obviously mods are always granted more privileges out of necessity on a forum but I just thought that wasn't the right thing to do, especially since later you chose to only remove negative points while retaining your positive points. If you were choosing "not to participate"- why didn't you end up removing it all so you'd end up with a straight zero after chipper changed everything?

Just food for thought, no hard feelings man. You said it was being abused- how so? And if you did clear everything before the change- please let me know so I can retract part of what I've said here. I only wanted to say this because of the effect it had when chip changed the system to the deduction type deal so sorry for being late to the party, so to speak.

Monkawat, please read the entire thread.  I DID end up deleting both positive and negative points, shortly before I made this thread.

I realized I fucked up by only deleting negative points, hence this apology.  After discussing this issue with others in this thread, I also agreed to not give out any points, positive or negative.  In effect I had my karma system turned off. 

I had a message on my signature line about this.  I deleted that sig line when the new system was implemented.  I only started accepting points again when the new system was started a few days ago.

I would still like an option to turn off one's karma system on a case-by-case basis.  I think this new "positive only" system is a good compromise between the old system and no karma at all though.

I appreciate your concerns, but you really are late to this party.  Please let this die.  It's been dealt with and it's over.

.........................

Thanks St. T and Jega.  I'd like people to think I'm a decent person.  I think I am. 

[CHEF]

You fucked up - you admitted it - you apologized - boom, we move on

Johnny M could learn a thing or 2 from u