dopetalk
Core Topics => Substance Usage, Management, User Experiences etc. => Topic started by: Güey on October 31, 2016, 12:47:24 AM
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Anyone got any answers? Theories? Anything...???
It took me at least a month to pick up my first habit, and even then, it was mild. Now, after being clean a bit, if I use 2 days in a row, I'm back to being hooked to the gills. I'm sure youse guys know the phenomenon. Just curious why that is???
Any thoughts?
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Well, if you believe the disease model of addiction it's why they call it progressive. Once you've had a tissue dependence on a substance, anytime you reintroduce that substance into your system it reactivates the dependence almost as if you never stopped using.
I go back and forth with the whole addiction as a disease theory, but I know from experience that it doesn't take hardly any time at all for me to get strung out again even after long term abstinence.
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Some of it is your state of mind too,. I used once a day for 3 days a few weeks ago, and felt like shit for a day or two. Then i just used the last 5 days (last7 out of 9 days) and today i honestly dont even feel bad. I guess sometimes we get an easy one every once in awhile.
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I go back and forth with the disease model, too. I also think a lot of it is mental. After we have a habit, get clean and use again, I think our minds are already racing ahead to the inevitable cherry on top of every run....horrible withdrawal sickness! That would explain why after a few days we already feel like a pile of shit!
I do think there is merit to the "progressive disease" theory too, though. I know that even after some clean time, when ever I used again, I found that my tolerance never dropped as much as one would expect and that after only a day or two I am using my pre-clean amounts.
So, I'm going to go with I think it is a combination of both!
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I put it down to muscle memory - you have two tolerances, short term and long term.
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Well said chipper. Its kind of what i think, we are all creatures of habit. Wake up, eat, sleep repeat. (oh and get high for a lot members on this forum). Everyone has their routines.
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I think your quest has mornto do with the physical part of dependency and not the mental part yes? If you do mean the physical part of the brain I think it has to do with the absolute strength of how fucking strong the hold of opies become on your brain. SO it's easy for that switch to get flipped back to junky mode in a heartbeat. Who knows I might be of by a lot
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Don't quote me because it's late and I'm going off memory...
Supposedly we rewire our brains permanently once we become addicted. So the brain knows immediately what's going on, and shuts down its normal endorphin production. Seems like once the body decides to turn off the normal production of endorphins, the body takes a period of time to achieve homeostasis again.
For example when your body flip flops between hot to cold during withdrawal, that's your body trying to figure out what temperature it should be again. So my guess would be if someone experiences a withdrawal after a small few days of use, then the normal endorphin production has been affected by the outside influence of opiates flooding those receptors.
I also recall the body produces more opiate receptors when one uses opiates heavily. I think as a defense mechanism. Not sure if that would aid in increased time for physical dependence issues.
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Haha its late for me too. Fucking insomnia :(
I like that answer. I'll buy that....
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Don't quote me because it's late and I'm going off memory...
Supposedly we rewire our brains permanently once we become addicted. So the brain knows immediately what's going on, and shuts down its normal endorphin production. Seems like once the body decides to turn off the normal production of endorphins, the body takes a period of time to achieve homeostasis again.
For example when your body flip flops between hot to cold during withdrawal, that's your body trying to figure out what temperature it should be again. So my guess would be if someone experiences a withdrawal after a small few days of use, then the normal endorphin production has been affected by the outside influence of opiates flooding those receptors.
I also recall the body produces more opiate receptors when one uses opiates heavily. I think as a defense mechanism. Not sure if that would aid in increased time for physical dependence issues.
there was a really good video on youtube of a professor explaining opiate addiction and what is going on in your brain as far as opiate recepetors, how opiates effect them, all that, really explained everything in depth and in a way that someone not studying for a Ph.D. could understand. i had it bookmarked years ago (i never got around to watching the whole thing, was too busy at the time) but i dont anymore and im desperately trying to find it again. I was actually going to post a thread about it, but figured it's a bit too vague a question. If i manage to find it, I'll post it here
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I would think that the part of the brain affected by opioid use, the nucleus accumbens, plays a large role in what you are asking about.
Here's what I mean. The nucleus accumben's main role is reward, motivation and aversion. In other words, it's the part of the brain that tells you that having sex feels good, so you want to have lots of sex. It's the part of the brain that tells you not to stick your hand on the hot stove, because it reminds you about the time you were 3 years old and touched the shiny red thing on the stove and burned yourself. These things are vital to the survival of an individual, therefore, the nucleus accumbens, is a key component in evolution.
That one time when you were 3 and burned your hand is enough to remind you your entire life not to do it again. With drugs, particularly opioids, you activate the reward pathway in the nucleus acc. Each time you use, you reinforce that pathway. When you have become addicted, what you've done is "trick" your brain into believing that your drug of choice is VITAL for survival. That's why it is so hard to quit. Your brain truly believes that you need it to survive!
Now, here is my little hypothesis on getting re-addicted quickly: I believe that nucleus acc. plays a role. Being that it plays a crucial part in species survival, I am sure it has a good bit of influence over the other parts of the brain and body. After you've been clean and re-introduce your favorite opioid into the body, the nucleus acc. must kick into high gear saying to your body, "I know this drug. It is vital to survival. Prioritize it."
This must have a trickle-down effect all the way down to the cellular level. For example, the number of opioid receptors rise.
I am sure the brain's plasticity plays a role in tolerance building.
Bottom line, the brain be a complicated mother-fucker!
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Idk about getting readdicted... But I know why I stay addicted. I got a taste of it the other day waiting for the mail. My anxiety gets so extreme I can barely walk outside. When someone drives by I like jump and run inside. Well walk casually but you know what I mean.
Seriously nothing I've taken allows me to have no social anxiety beside booze. But booze it pretty toxic so I'll stick to my tea.
And all my family knows about my addiction, I actually not ashamed. I've straight up told them all, it's morphine, yes it's addictive, I am addicted. That's another thing that keeps me going. I don't really care if people judge me.
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Idk about getting readdicted... But I know why I stay addicted. I got a taste of it the other day waiting for the mail. My anxiety gets so extreme I can barely walk outside. When someone drives by I like jump and run inside. Well walk casually but you know what I mean.
And all my family knows about my addiction, I actually not ashamed. I've straight up told them all, it's morphine, yes it's addictive, I am addicted. That's another thing that keeps me going. I don't really care if people judge me.
I'm certainly not judging. Hope you didn't take it that way.
Mostly I meant PHYSICALLY readdicted After my disastrous decision to get off MMT, I've been going crazy with IV bth The wheels are seriously falling off. My family and friends all know, and they are supportive. But mostly they're mystified as to why I can't fucking stay away...
In the past 2 years I've kicked so many fucking times. I get clean, and go right back. my original post was in reference to, when I do go back, after 13 days, 10 days, 6 days, whatever... I use a few times and BAM! 8 hours later I've got the runny nose, watery eyes, the whole trip...
They're fixing to send people to Mars, for fuck sake. Why can't they invent a dirt cheap dilaudid type opiate that's not addictive? ?? Ah, every junkies dream :) jaja
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Naw man I didn't mean it that way.
You'll have to exuse me sometimes, I don't know what it's like to be a real junkie. I'm like a baby junkie. My only habbit is seeds. I've never even seen heroin, so I really don't know what it's like to hustle day in and day out. Doing shit I'm not proud of ect. I can see how that would wear down a soul really quick.
So it is I who appoligize.