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Core Topics => Drug Testing & Analysis => Topic started by: nick on October 07, 2015, 06:34:14 AM

Title: What do pods show up as in a urine test?
Post by: nick on October 07, 2015, 06:34:14 AM

I know they'll obviously show up as the standard opiates(morphine/codeine) but what are the odds the thebaine content would show us as buprenorphine in a standard test as opposed to a GC-MS test?

Title: Re: What do pods show up as in a urine test?
Post by: Jega on October 07, 2015, 07:13:25 AM

That seams impossible to tell. It depends on how your body metabolizes it.

Title: Re: What do pods show up as in a urine test?
Post by: Morfy on October 07, 2015, 07:29:53 AM

Yeah Nick,

Here's a journal article detailing the detection of thebaine as an indicator of poppy seed consumption, ostensibly to rule-out the use of hard drugs, due to the presence of morphine & codeine metabolites: http://jat.oxfordjournals.org/content/21/5/376.full.pdf (http://jat.oxfordjournals.org/content/21/5/376.full.pdf)

I don't think buprenorphine can form naturally (that little carbon triangle on the nitrogen is unnatural, IMO).

Thinking of all the opioids made from thebaine...., if you look at the figgers below, see what looks most like thebaine (I think all your body does is add MORE chemicals to it, labeling it for excretion):

Thebaine :(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1f/Thebaine_skeletal.svg/200px-Thebaine_skeletal.svg.png)

Boop: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b0/Buprenorphine.svg/220px-Buprenorphine.svg.png)

Oxycod: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9b/Oxycodone.svg/220px-Oxycodone.svg.png)

Oxymorf: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8c/Oxymorphone2DCSD.svg/170px-Oxymorphone2DCSD.svg.png)

Naloxone: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2f/Naloxone.svg/220px-Naloxone.svg.png)

Naltrexone: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4d/Naltrexone_skeletal.svg/220px-Naltrexone_skeletal.svg.png)

Thebaine should show up as nothing other than metabolised thebaine; but it is VERY close to morphine & codeine, less so to the other opioids, I think.

Okay, I just looked into it: in rats, at least, some thebaine is metabolised to other opiates, namely codeine, morphine & oripavine.

Thebaine, an intermediate of morphine biosynthesis in the poppy plant, Papaver somniferum, was transformed to oripavine, codeine, and morphine by rat liver, kidney, and brain microsomes in the presence of an NADPH-generating system. The formation of morphine, codeine, and oripavine was identified by a specific RIA, HPLC, and GCMS. Thebaine also gave rise to four other compounds, which for the moment are unidentified.

Title: Re: What do pods show up as in a urine test?
Post by: Jega on October 07, 2015, 07:34:40 AM

Man I must have high. Morfys right .That little carbon triangle on the nitrogen is unnatural to me too!

Title: Re: What do pods show up as in a urine test?
Post by: Morfy on October 07, 2015, 07:50:10 AM

Quote from: Jega on October 07, 2015, 07:34:40 AM

Man I must have high. Morfys right .That little carbon triangle on the nitrogen is unnatural to me too!

Yeah right?

Also look at the naltrexone, it also shares buprenorphine's "Weird Little Nitrogen Triangle."

* Note, I was going to say "Faggy Little Nitrogen Triangle", faggy in the sense of odd or weird, but thought better of it: this isn't the 1980's any more.  We have to be sensitive to everyone's feelings. 

Although it DOES roll of the tongue better.

Title: Re: What do pods show up as in a urine test?
Post by: nick on October 07, 2015, 07:56:39 AM

Quote from: Morfy on October 07, 2015, 07:29:53 AM

Yeah Nick,

Here's a journal article detailing the detection of thebaine as an indicator of poppy seed consumption, ostensibly to rule-out the use of hard drugs, due to the presence of morphine & codeine metabolites: http://jat.oxfordjournals.org/content/21/5/376.full.pdf (http://jat.oxfordjournals.org/content/21/5/376.full.pdf)

I don't think buprenorphine can form naturally (that little carbon triangle on the nitrogen is unnatural, IMO).

Thinking of all the opioids made from thebaine...., if you look at the figgers below, see what looks most like thebaine (I think all your body does is add MORE chemicals to it, labeling it for excretion):

Thebaine :(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1f/Thebaine_skeletal.svg/200px-Thebaine_skeletal.svg.png)

Boop: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b0/Buprenorphine.svg/220px-Buprenorphine.svg.png)

Oxycod: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9b/Oxycodone.svg/220px-Oxycodone.svg.png)

Oxymorf: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8c/Oxymorphone2DCSD.svg/170px-Oxymorphone2DCSD.svg.png)

Naloxone: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2f/Naloxone.svg/220px-Naloxone.svg.png)

Naltrexone: (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4d/Naltrexone_skeletal.svg/220px-Naltrexone_skeletal.svg.png)

Thebaine should show up as nothing other than metabolised thebaine; but it is VERY close to morphine & codeine, less so to the other opioids, I think.

Okay, I just looked into it: in rats, at least, some thebaine is metabolised to other opiates, namely codeine, morphine & oripavine.

Thebaine, an intermediate of morphine biosynthesis in the poppy plant, Papaver somniferum, was transformed to oripavine, codeine, and morphine by rat liver, kidney, and brain microsomes in the presence of an NADPH-generating system. The formation of morphine, codeine, and oripavine was identified by a specific RIA, HPLC, and GCMS. Thebaine also gave rise to four other compounds, which for the moment are unidentified.

Good post-thanks.  I knew thebaine was used as the marker for pod/seed use,but thankfully it doesn't come on the standard panel test.
I was just concerned that thebaine from pods could be mistaken for buprenorphine.So,you think this is unlikely?- I know thebaine has a different detection period to bup.