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Core Topics => Opiates & Opioids => Drugs => Methadone and Buprenorphine Maintenance => Topic started by: nikita70 on August 19, 2016, 07:43:47 PM
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Hi guys.
I humbly beg an excuse if the question I'm going to ask is so silly that it offens the collective wisedom of this board.
Unluckily, I failed with this bupe' transiton, let myself go and turned back to the 'done. Doesn't matter why. Just didn't work to me, as I have expected. Maybe next time it's going to be easier to make it. Kidding, kidding, kidding.
So well, I have stashed some, but since I'm not provided with any regular supplies (like clinic stuff) anymore, I'm still kinda short of it (well, at least I'm finding myself feel like that-as if I WERE tight, even if I'm not in some urgent need at the moment),
therefore I'm trying to be as sparing as possible, and make up/"patching" the shortcomings with the bupe.
I'm doing my methadone with the bupe alternately, (like few days on the 'done/1-2 of bupe), what I somehow intuitionally consider as probably dangerous practice, the silliest, most unconcerned and lighheartly thing ever done.
Anyway, no matter HOW it works, it does it to me, so it fixes me relatively well without even to get into acute PWD anymore-I guess my system got "retrained" for a bupe, at least partially-some mild discomfort and this feeling of there's some molecular battle going on inside of you is still very vivid.
How do you think, is there some potentially risk to develope an "extra-bupe' habit" and improve the tolerance for methadone? Or maybe exactly the opposite, considering the mixed, anti-antagonistic properties/features of the bupe???
I also wanted to refer to some other thread, I mean the post about searching for potentially non-addictive opies-I have forgotten the title of it.
Remember @Jega mention the possibly miraculous drug might be the combination of bupe and Mu receptor agonist.
Would it be possibly that using bupe somehow prevents me from developing the higher level of tolerance as for pure agonists, indeed, but symultanously is the "trap" itself?
Does it make any sense?
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Nikita, using the two and getting relief from that combination will just push up your tolerance and will make it that much harder for when you run out of Methadone.
Try to taper off the 'done so you can land softly.
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Nikita you never have to ask our apologys for you to post. This board loves you and your writing and if you need to talk that's what we're here for.
First I believe the thread and drug you were referencing the following. My apologies if it's not.
http://forum.drugs-and-users.org/index.php/topic,3023.msg33805.html#msg33805
The drug is still very preliminary stage and isn't a practical option right now even if it delivered on the promises that it makes which I'm not sure I believe.
Don't beat yourself on having to go back on done Nikita! It happens! This is hard! And don't beat yourself up on screwing up on your plan with subs too. While both of us know you need to get off one of them, and then the other one to finally get clean this is a process and you work at. Sometimes you work at it day by day, sometimes hour by hour but it's a long process and you can't expect yourself to win every battle.
As far as your question I may not be getting the idea you're proposing correctly and if I'm not for that I'm sorry, but I can't see how the buprenorphine prevents you from developing a higher level of tolerance for pure agonists. If anything I'd say the bupe is somewhat counteracting pure agonists. Bupe if a strange med though, it realty is.
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It may work a couple days on done then sub a couple times while the bupe is still in your system,. But if you take no sub and take done for more than 2-3 days im pretty sure youre gonna put yourself in a lot of misery.
You can do sub then as much dope(any full agonist) as you can do without oding, but never do dope(any full agonist) then sub. Some have to experience pwds for themselves though, i know i did myself. Never want that feeling ever again though.
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(...)
As far as your question I may not be getting the idea you're proposing correctly and if I'm not for that I'm sorry, but I can't see how the buprenorphine prevents you from developing a higher level of tolerance for pure agonists. If anything I'd say the bupe is somewhat counteracting pure agonists. Bupe if a strange med though, it realty is.
@Jega , @chipper ,
Thank you for your kindest words, guys.
I'm not surprised at all that you can't get this vague idea, since even I can barely follow my own mindtrack...
It has "clicked" in my head as I reminded someone on Opiophile amplifying/elaborating on how possibly could the antiagonist properties of Naloxone contribute to/work for reducing of the tolerance for pure agonists, as microdosing systematically, or so.
This person was basically standing at the point "if abusing of agonists leads to improving the tolerance' level, then we may as well expect the antiagonists doing exactly the same, but just inreversely".
Like using Narcan to develope some sort of UN-TOLERANCE/tolerance contraversely.
I'm not a chemist (and not hard-scientific mind at all), so it somehow appealed to me, since it sounded logically,
by the other hand, I realize that such a "common" logic might simply not be working for this level, just like that, and suppose the idea to be a simplification or wishful thinking.
Honestly, I'd like to learn if there's a grain of truth in it.
@Dog Food ,
this is exactly what I was afraid it might be... I did some "done today (20mgs or so), after 2-3 day off the bupe and felt something is wrong/not the same, as before yesterday I barely got off/nodded nicely on exactly the same dose...
This is survivable to me, I mean not anything severe, still feeds thoughts...
The doc that has put me into this confusion is really some underestimated individual, lol, definitely one of the mostly narrow-minds I ever met, since he insisted to recover me for ANY price-even adding an extra habit seems to be involved in a risk.