dopetalk
Core Topics => Opiates & Opioids => Drugs => Heroin => Topic started by: Griffin on September 27, 2015, 11:28:12 PM
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So I have a question do the cartels make both bth and ecp? Do they just ship the ECP to the east coast and the bth to my side of the country? Or does most of the ecp come from places like eastern europe, middle east, and se asia then get brought in from them or sold to the cartels and they only keep it on the east side of the country because its coming in from the ports on the east coast?
I guess if its being bought by the cartels, if they aren't making it themselves, they don't want to spend the extra time, hassle, and chance or getting it seized by bringing it to the west cost if it's coming in from the east. If not and they are just making both from the poppies they grow in Mexico then wtf cartels! Show the west coast some love! I know there has been quite a few sightngs in the last year or 2 of more brown Mexican powder and ecp on the west coast. I would like to hear about that if you have had it here on the west coasts and your thoughts. It would be nice to be able to get some and try it out here. We may need to petition the cartels and go on strike with some picket signs so we can get some powder over here hah who is with me!
I would love to snort some ecp after I get off paper of course because imo (which can't be taken for any kind of fact because I have never had ECP in my life) snorting ecp would get you higher or have a higher B/A than smoking bth. If your getting good bth people could definitely disagree though and I would love to hear from both sides. I don't want this to turn into an ECP vs BTH quality and preference battle thread though!
I was never able to get high on smoking BTH. I had a huge habit when I first started doing H. I also wasn't getting the best product either. There were only a few times that I got really good bth and I used quite a few different delivery services but it was only a handful of times that it was really good. Getting quality BTH didn't really depend on the delivery service because they all seemed to have close to the same quality to me here in CO. If people have had different experiences let me know though. I never used it when I lived in Oklahoma so it could be different state to state so definitely voice your opinion on the matter.
I only used H for a short period of time and want more info on the subject and want to hear peoples stories who have tried both or were able to get good enough BTH to get high smoking it. I mainly want to know why only tar for us west coasters. Everything I got seemed to be in the same quality range which was good but not great. I know you guys also have this on the east coast with the ecp. There is just something about the stamps, and being able to know the quality and have options with an open air market that sounds alluring to me. Of course going to the hood all the time or unknowingly getting Fent does not sound fun. I may move to the east coast if I pick up a habit again just to try it out and check it off the bucket list.
Even if I don't pick up a habit I want to check out the east coast and live at a few places there. If anyone has any good recommendations about great places to live that have good dope with open air markets or places that are cool to live that don't have open air markets definitely post them up. I would love to learn a lot about more it because I have always wanted to live on the east coast at least for a little while. Thanks for the info and please post up your stories if you have tried both or have only had one and your thoughts and opinions on the subject.
(PS if this thread would be better in the scene category please do move it there for me mods thanks guys you are the greatest I love this community that you've built and maintain so THANK YOU!)
Griffin
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I have done a considerable amount of both bth and ecp. Currently I live on the east coast so ecp is what is available, and it is very very good at the moment. As far as the differences between the two, I tend to find a nice shot of bth a bit more sedating than ecp and could be because of the residual morphine left in the bth during the extraction process. I feel like the shots of ecp hit harder and last longer though.
In a perfect world both would be available to all of us but that's just not the case. It is nice to get something different for a change and switching it up definitely "tricks" the tolerance into thinking the dope is much stronger even if it isn't in my case.
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Imho most of the ecp it's made in Columbia
While must of your tar is made in Mexico
Then again it maybe what drives the market.
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All of the cartels are distinct entities. They have wars between them over territory and shipping routes. So, saying the cartels do something is incorrect. They each operate in their own way, and some import tar, while others import bth. I have a feeling that it depends on the sophistication of their operation.
A lot of the small town tar for example, is imported by independents from the tar production region of xalisco. They get referred to as xalisco boys, but they don't seem to be organised in the same way as the other cartels. Google xalisco boys and there are a few cool articles.
Apparently a lot of the method and ecp is imported by Sinaloa. They are the largest cartel, and their leader is the dude who recently built a tunnel into his jail cell shower over several miles to escape. El chapo Guzman.
There are others like the zetas who are known for their hyper aggro. They post a lot of beheading videos, and cut off a shitload of hands. There are some fucked up ones if you are into that like the chainsaw beheading. Very very fucked up. Don't say I didn't warn you.
Anyways, point being they all buy from different sources and sell in different areas.
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Pellets, planes and the new frontier
Mexican cartels are making ecp, as well as importing some from Colombia.
Here's a decent story on it: http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/national/2015/09/24/pellets-planes-and-the-new-frontier/
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All of the cartels are distinct entities. They have wars between them over territory and shipping routes. So, saying the cartels do something is incorrect. They each operate in their own way, and some import tar, while others import bth. I have a feeling that it depends on the sophistication of their operation.
A lot of the small town tar for example, is imported by independents from the tar production region of xalisco. They get referred to as xalisco boys, but they don't seem to be organised in the same way as the other cartels. Google xalisco boys and there are a few cool articles.
Apparently a lot of the method and ecp is imported by Sinaloa. They are the largest cartel, and their leader is the dude who recently built a tunnel into his jail cell shower over several miles to escape. El chapo Guzman.
There are others like the zetas who are known for their hyper aggro. They post a lot of beheading videos, and cut off a shitload of hands. There are some fucked up ones if you are into that like the chainsaw beheading. Very very fucked up. Don't say I didn't warn you.
Anyways, point being they all buy from different sources and sell in different areas.
Z,if you haven't read "Dreamland:the making of America's heroin epidemic" check it out.
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Pellets, planes and the new frontier
Mexican cartels are making ecp, as well as importing some from Colombia.
this makes the most sense. the columbians are shipping some ecp with the coke through the mexicans and the mexicans are making up the difference. in a way, good quality is a result, as there is no need to cut the shit to hell to meet the demand. and for what its worth, BTH is at some of its better quality(at least where i am at) then it has been over the past 5 years. of course, there are those people, who are younger than me, who tell me how it was back in the day when a match head of bth would kill people, but i dont pay them any attention.
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Pellets, planes and the new frontier
Mexican cartels are making ecp, as well as importing some from Colombia.
this makes the most sense. the columbians are shipping some ecp with the coke through the mexicans and the mexicans are making up the difference. in a way, good quality is a result, as there is no need to cut the shit to hell to meet the demand. and for what its worth, BTH is at some of its better quality(at least where i am at) then it has been over the past 5 years. of course, there are those people, who are younger than me, who tell me how it was back in the day when a match head of bth would kill people, but i dont pay them any attention.
About 3 or 4 years ago (I'm just kind of estimating) the BTH, where I'm at, went from being cheap and poor quality to much more expensive and much higher quality. People started calling it "pure". Now that's all you can find. I'm happy about it because the old stuff must have had so much cut in it, blech.
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Pellets, planes and the new frontier
Mexican cartels are making ecp, as well as importing some from Colombia.
Here's a decent story on it: http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/national/2015/09/24/pellets-planes-and-the-new-frontier/
on the streets, heroin is called girl. Crack is boy
wrong
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About 3 or 4 years ago (I'm just kind of estimating) the BTH, where I'm at, went from being cheap and poor quality to much more expensive and much higher quality. People started calling it "pure". Now that's all you can find. I'm happy about it because the old stuff must have had so much cut in it, blech.
what is pricing like in WA no compared to 3-4 years ago??
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I've done quite a bit of both. Powder to me is a cleaner more pharmaceutical type high. BTH is a lot like pod tea if you've ever had that. I'd explain the difference as kind of like dro vs reggie except they can be equally potent. One is clean and more of a euphoric almost stimulating type of feeling. The other is a bit dirty and a bit mixed up and makes you feel a bit stupid but in a good way. Tar is a natural kinda high. Bad tar is a lot harder to deal with than bad powder. If I had it my way, I'd definitely choose powder on the day to day but would have a fat shot of tar waiting for when I really want to nod.
For whatever it's worth, I live in Houston, aka right next to Mexico, and we get both tar and powder. Some of the powder we get is a dark brown #4 which is pretty rare. We also get a light tan/off white powder which is more prevalent. I believe the brown stuff is made by Mexicans while the tan is made in South America and trafficked by Mexicans.
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I too have done a considerable amount of both BTH and ECP.
While I have done a TON of heroin, it's usually only when I'm either in a new area or can't get my drugs jmof choice.
My drugs of choice are as follows in ranking of favorability and usage.
1. Oxymorphome 2. Hydromorphone 3. Oxycodone 4. Heroin. 5. Methadone 6. Morphine.
I'm really not crazy about heroin dud to the wild card nature of quality. I prefer knowing exactly what I'm getting instead of having a chance to get good or bad dope. It's too soul crushing for me to spend lots of money on dope only to get low quality schtuff.
My black tar experiemce began when I lived in Las Vegas. No one knew anything about pharms and all that was around was heroin.
In the half a year or so that lived there and worked in Cali, the quality and consistency of the BTH varied wildly. Even though I'm not a snoker, almost every week when my dealer got new batches if tar, he would give me free bags if I would test it with him so he knew how much cut to add and how much to sell. He would get me to smoke some and inject some every batch. Personally I hate the taste of BTH smoked. Blechhh.
Out of the 12 or so batches I tried like that, only a couple gave me a buzz from smoking. Idk if it's because of my tolerance or bad dope but smoking almost never did anythung for me.
Hell, out of a bunch of different batches and dealers, I only had some that had a solid IV rush once or twice. I would inject and not feel anything rush like, but would quickly get high as fuck. Had to always do small shots because of how dangerous it was.
Now ECP is a different story. Most always had some sort of a rush when IV'd and got me decently high even when smoked (when I was without rigs).
Tldr; I've smoked a lot of BTH and ECP and generally didn't have a great time with a majority of the BTH.
Hope I helped.
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Man I have chased the dragon with bth. It is a more Suttle high but it worked for me. I live in the south. So BTH is more prominent here. Though ecp has been showing up more over the years. You do get taxed for it. Ecp tends to me to be a more clean high. Even kinda speedy like banging oxyC. Bth sedates you more. Much easier to nod out on. This question will never end.
Is bth better then ecp or vice versa... Having done both quite a bit... I prefer ecp. Much less hassle cause its powder and it's easier to prep. Not to mention easier on the viens. I enjoy the high more,seems I'm more productive as well. We're I'm at bth is 80-100 a g.
Ecp is at 120 - 150 a g. I'm to poor to afford dope though. Hahaha. I never cop under a g or it kinda Pisses me off.
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Bth is cartel shit that is #3 and not great for shooting, made for smoking. In dc Ecp is Colombian or afghan. I get Afghan powder that is beige, turns golden. some times some Asian light white rocky powder that turns dar brown with water added. Not sure where that's from. Colombian takes a while to stir, and has a tar like consistency when applying water. Leaves cotton black. Afghan is the best, nice morphine base. That's how it is in dc anyway, unless your getting half's or 20s of cut up afghan.
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So you're getting Asian powder and you're not sure where it's from? Tar is definitely not #3 and is wholly water soluble... well except for some of the cuts but you know what I mean.
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wrong
Yeah that quote was fucking lame. Like c'mon journalist.
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I have done my share of both, scoring tar from St. Louis west (shite) to Denver (ok), Albuquerque (quite good), Las Vegas (the best by far), Los Angeles (good), and San Diego (better than L.A.) The Albuquerque and San Diego shit was black as pitch and a nice rush came with the shot. Oh, San Francisco too of course (terrible compared to my expectations both in 2000 and 2013)
So that Vegas shit was a trip. Circa 2001. Got stuck there with a couple friends. Sick every day, but managing to score every day eventually as well. Anyone who knows how shit works there for street kids at least knows that you can't just find dope. "Pussy, crack, and speed" is commonly advertised on Fremont St, but not dope. It's a real pain in the ass. We had to find a junkie, who had a dealer's number, and then buy her a 1 and 1 every time we needed to buy. They were 15 in 2001. The dealers would show up, two Mexicans in a car, and one would spit out the black, one would spit out the white as the exchange happened. From their mouths directly to ours. God, I can still taste that latex. Finally she gave up the number...after a month or so of piggy backing off of us. At first I didn't bother to add the white, but that quickly changed, and holy fuck can I tell you that the rush from those Vegas speedballs was the best feeling of my life, and steady too 15 bucks day in and day out, same quality. The dope had short legs, though unfortunately, wearing off in about 8 hours. Also, these fucking dealers! They had hours! They opened at 8 a.m. and closed at 8 p.m. If you couldn't come up in that window your were fucked. Other dealers stayed open till 9 or 10 p.m., but those numbers were coveted by all. I know I got well many a time from a junkie who didn't have a number and I scored for...for a small price.
The ECP I have done in Chicago (shite in 2000), but all accounts claim different now. Also Detroit which is much better now than it used to be, and finally Baltimore where I was expecting to get blown the fuck out, but my oxy tolerance was so high at the time that it didn't touch me...that's what's peculiar about the Vegas dope. We were just running out of oc's when we got there and tolerance doesn't drop that quickly, but that dope got us off like mad from the get go.
There's a good doc on youtube about the fent that's showing up in Mass in particular. There is one scene where the filmmaker goes down to Sinaloa, and the dudes show a couple kilos of dope cut with synthesized fent that they paid a chemist 50 grand to develop, which he did successfully. This shit is what's being seen in Mass and prolly Philly and lots of other places. It's the same tan I get in Detroit today, but I gotta shoot a half gram to really get off, so I'm betting there's not much fent in what I'm getting...which makes me feel oddly left out.
This is the part in Mexico. There are 6 parts if you fuckers are interested. It's a good doc, but the bitch annoys me. Those dealers were straight up just selling weed just a few years ago. That's how profitable this shit is!
Peace!
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Oh! And Amsterdam in 1998, my first experience was sublime! Snorted a little bit of brown powder in a pay toilet at the train station before the ride to Prague. I nodded for a good long while.
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it has to be big business to cater to filmmakers who want to interview "drug dealers"
every doc Ive seen from her has been more sensational than informative.
he tells her a giant bag of fent is dangerous and you have to be careful and then casually mixes it with his finger.
"get the walkie talkies, sunglasses, and some brown sugar. a journalist is coming"
and jesus dude did you really make that name just to post your opinion on dope you tried a couple times in each city? i could go on naming dope Ive tried from different cities but that hardly means I get to say the dope from there is good or not. that reminds me a lot of the kind of logic you hear when you someone says "dude I had a flight stop at tennessee once, the chicks there are ugly as fuck."
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I'm just sharing experiences, neighbor. I claim to be an authority on none of it. It's life and life only. The name is merely a representation of what I consider to be extensive travels, especially for a junkie. It has way more to do with duality than claiming one type of dope is better than the other. Well, technically, I think the dude told her it was a mixed half key ready for export, but fo sho...that fanger mixing shit was ridic.
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fair enough. I apologize if I came off mean. its just hard to read your post and not feel like you are saying entire cities have bad dope. Im sure youre aware its all about who you know
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Yeah I wasn't going to say anything but I kinda felt like that whole encounter was staged too...
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No worries mah man! So much of life is who one knows, innit? Shit, I got sold road tar as chiva in Denver. The scary thing is that when these kinds of things happen to peeps, they sometimes ingest them. Blanket decriminalization anybody? Yeah...that chick may not have even been in Mexico. Who knows? Good on yous for calling them on their bullshit. That Unisys shite is disturbing, but typical though. Be vell!
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There are others like the zetas who are known for their hyper aggro. They post a lot of beheading videos, and cut off a shitload of hands. There are some fucked up ones if you are into that like the chainsaw beheading. Very very fucked up. Don't say I didn't warn you.
It's shit like this that makes me shake my head in bewilderment and wonder why the fuck the world's governments still insist on fighting the "War" on Drugs, rather than opting for blanket legalization and regulation of recreational drugs. Then again I'm just a lowly citizen who couldn't possibly understand the full scope and political impact the cartels have.
I have a feeling that someday down the road, as voters in the US come to their senses and begin to vote for the passage of recreational drug legalization laws, it's going to come out that the reason we can't legalize is because it would lose the US government hundreds of millions of dollars in cartel bribes. In fact it would not surprise me in the slightest if the DEA/CIA had a deal with the cartels that states exactly how much dope is to be seized vs. how much dope is let in to the country and in exchange the gov gets a cut of the profits. And part of that agreement would be that drugs stay illegal, and if a new prescription drug is developed that might threaten the existing illicit market, it should be scheduled immediately and the DEA must do everything possible to ensure that the heroin market is not affected, including demonizing and persecuting compassionate doctors.
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Bro, look into the Mena, Arkansas CIA operation alone...the culprits of which got promoted to the highest levels of American gubment, and then tell me that they just stopped doing business with the cartels. The war in Afghanistan was almost 90 percent about gaining access to the highest yielding poppies on the planet. Sick fucks we have to deal with...