Author Topic: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation  (Read 18279 times)

Offline Chip (OP)

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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2015, 07:17:09 AM »
the software can do anything if someone writes the code.

I reckon leaving it alone now. it works.
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2015, 07:41:09 AM »
I also like the idea of being able to leave a comment. I try to PM the person anyway; whether its b/c I don't want to derail a thread (but want to acknowledge what they said), or thank them for what they posted etc. Just my .002 
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2015, 07:49:22 AM »
me too. there are mods. I could look for.

yes, Opio's forum software was world class.
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Offline jdub

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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2015, 08:55:02 AM »
It looks like it was disabled?

I think the "give neg rep, get neg rep" system is dumb. If someone does or says something fucked-up, I have to give myself negative rep in order to downvote them? If anything, deduct .25-.5 POSITIVE Rep points for every downvote. Conversely, anytime you give someone POSITIVE rep, deduct .25-.5 neg rep pts.

Offline neighbor

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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2015, 09:24:46 AM »
while I'd like to think we are all adults, and a positive-negative rep function could be fine, ultimately it has a negative effect on the forum.

it turns an insignificant, small amount of negativity, into a flaming shit ball of negativity with wings

just do away with it. most of us dont care about neg rep but some do. its not like everyone would miss having the ability to give it. though admittedly I love the word smite and would hate to see that go.
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #19 on: September 01, 2015, 09:44:36 AM »
hence my poll option.
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #20 on: September 01, 2015, 10:22:51 AM »
I think we should either keep it positive only, or turn it off altogether.  The way it is now, with just positive, is fine with me.  If we have to go back to allowing negative, I think we should have the modification Chipper is talking about.  Either the person giving negative rep looses a positive, or by giving a negative point they get a negative.  I like the former (giving negative deletes a positive).  That's my opinion and I'm not changing it.  It incentivizes the person to not abuse the negative system.  I'd also still like the option for people to turn off their rep system on a case-by-case basis..  Meaning they turn off their rep, while others can still enjoy theirs.

No, I wasn't the only one complaining of abuse of the karma system.  A few others were too.  I'm also not the only one who thinks it was being abused.  By now, by my count, I'd have -25 Karma points.  Do you honestly think that's warranted?  I try to be helpful on here, post good posts, apologize when I fuck up.  You can't convince me that some of those points weren't based on negative personal feelings.  That's NOT what the karma system is for.  Negative Karma is for disagreeing on a strong level.  By strong level I mean something you adamantly disagree with.  It's not meant for the casual disagreement, or ambivalence to posts.  Some people were abusing the system.

As for me being an admin, thanks for the vote of confidence.   ::)   I'll say this again, I didn't ask to be an admin.  I told Chipper I didn't want to be obligated to be here or do work when I didn't want to.  He said there wouldn't be any obligations.  Since I've been one though, I think I've done more good than bad.  I think people who disagree are probably letting their personal feelings enter into the equation.  I think some people thought I was going to automatically ban them, fuck with them, or be on some power trip.  I've not done any of those things.  The only thing I've reacted to was in the Opiophile Is Down thread, and that was b/c it was extremely personal to me.  It had to do with me as a member, not an admin.  Those feelings and opinions weren't meant to be some mandate for the entire board.  I would have thought that was obvious.  Apparently not. 

As I said, I'm more than willing to give people second chances.  I'm willing to put the past behind us.  But what I'm not willing to do is constantly defend myself against naysayers..  If the majority of people honestly don't want me in power, they're certainly free to vote me out when the time comes.  In all honesty I expected not to win anyway, even if I did stand for election. 
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #21 on: September 01, 2015, 10:25:57 AM »
I think we should either keep it positive only, or turn it off altogether.  The way it is now, with just positive, is fine with me.  If we have to go back to allowing negative, I think we should have the modification Chipper is talking about.  Either the person giving negative rep looses a positive, or by giving a negative point they get a negative.  I like the former (giving negative deletes a positive).  That's my opinion and I'm not changing it.  It incentivizes the person to not abuse the negative system.  I'd also still like the option for people to turn off their rep system on a case-by-case basis..  Meaning they turn off their rep, while others can still enjoy theirs.

No, I wasn't the only one complaining of abuse of the karma system.  A few others were too.  I'm also not the only one who thinks it was being abused.  By now, by my count, I'd have -25 Karma points.  Do you honestly think that's warranted?  I try to be helpful on here, post good posts, apologize when I fuck up.  You can't convince me that some of those points weren't based on negative personal feelings.  That's NOT what the karma system is for.  Negative Karma is for disagreeing on a strong level.  By strong level I mean something you adamantly disagree with.  It's not meant for the casual disagreement, or ambivalence to posts.  Some people were abusing the system.

As for me being an admin, thanks for the vote of confidence.   ::)   I'll say this again, I didn't ask to be an admin.  I told Chipper I didn't want to be obligated to be here or do work when I didn't want to.  He said there wouldn't be any obligations.  Since I've been one though, I think I've done more good than bad.  I think people who disagree are probably letting their personal feelings enter into the equation.  I think some people thought I was going to automatically ban them, fuck with them, or be on some power trip.  I've not done any of those things.  The only thing I've reacted to was in the Opiophile Is Down thread, and that was b/c it was extremely personal to me.  It had to do with me as a member, not an admin.  Those feelings and opinions weren't meant to be some mandate for the entire board.  I would have thought that was obvious.  Apparently not. 

As I said, I'm more than willing to give people second chances.  I'm willing to put the past behind us.  But what I'm not willing to do is constantly defend myself against naysayers..  If the majority of people honestly don't want me in power, they're certainly free to vote me out when the time comes.  In all honesty I expected not to win anyway, even if I did stand for election.

Can someone explain how its even possible for the rep to be "abused"? Apparently giving an admin more negative rep than they feel they deserve is "abuse"?

I agree with neighbor. Just do away with it, really not a big deal to me. But if this place is to be a democracy, that option needs to win in the poll.

Offline Chip (OP)

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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2015, 10:27:12 AM »
with this karma system we are all equals; one point per customer. interesting. i do miss Opio's though so that's what i will aim for.

the way it is now, it's a fair compromise. we salvage the good bits. applaud !
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #23 on: September 01, 2015, 10:29:14 AM »
Chipper, I misvoted.  I voted for "leave no support for negative karma," the first option. 

I thought that meant positive rep only, the way it is now, as in no negative karma.  I thought that was a happy compromise between the old system and no rep system at all.

After looking / thinking about it, I think the first option probably means turn it back to the old system.  I DO NOT vote for that.

I think it should either be positive only, modified negative (if you give negative, you loose a positive), or turned off altogether.

I couldn't find a way to change my vote.  If you know how, please do so. 
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #24 on: September 01, 2015, 10:31:05 AM »
I think we should either keep it positive only, or turn it off altogether.  The way it is now, with just positive, is fine with me.  If we have to go back to allowing negative, I think we should have the modification Chipper is talking about.  Either the person giving negative rep looses a positive, or by giving a negative point they get a negative.  I like the former (giving negative deletes a positive).  That's my opinion and I'm not changing it.  It incentivizes the person to not abuse the negative system.  I'd also still like the option for people to turn off their rep system on a case-by-case basis..  Meaning they turn off their rep, while others can still enjoy theirs.

No, I wasn't the only one complaining of abuse of the karma system.  A few others were too.  I'm also not the only one who thinks it was being abused.  By now, by my count, I'd have -25 Karma points.  Do you honestly think that's warranted?  I try to be helpful on here, post good posts, apologize when I fuck up.  You can't convince me that some of those points weren't based on negative personal feelings.  That's NOT what the karma system is for.  Negative Karma is for disagreeing on a strong level.  By strong level I mean something you adamantly disagree with.  It's not meant for the casual disagreement, or ambivalence to posts.  Some people were abusing the system.

As for me being an admin, thanks for the vote of confidence.   ::)   I'll say this again, I didn't ask to be an admin.  I told Chipper I didn't want to be obligated to be here or do work when I didn't want to.  He said there wouldn't be any obligations.  Since I've been one though, I think I've done more good than bad.  I think people who disagree are probably letting their personal feelings enter into the equation.  I think some people thought I was going to automatically ban them, fuck with them, or be on some power trip.  I've not done any of those things.  The only thing I've reacted to was in the Opiophile Is Down thread, and that was b/c it was extremely personal to me.  It had to do with me as a member, not an admin.  Those feelings and opinions weren't meant to be some mandate for the entire board.  I would have thought that was obvious.  Apparently not. 

As I said, I'm more than willing to give people second chances.  I'm willing to put the past behind us.  But what I'm not willing to do is constantly defend myself against naysayers..  If the majority of people honestly don't want me in power, they're certainly free to vote me out when the time comes.  In all honesty I expected not to win anyway, even if I did stand for election.

Can someone explain how its even possible for the rep to be "abused"? Apparently giving an admin more negative rep than they feel they deserve is "abuse"?

I agree with neighbor. Just do away with it, really not a big deal to me. But if this place is to be a democracy, that option needs to win in the poll.

I already explained that.  Please read again.  Applies to me and a few other people.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2015, 10:34:17 AM by Narkotikon »
Transparency is necessary to ensure decent staff members get elected. Members need to know when staff are misbehaving, so members can be informed voters.

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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2015, 10:31:52 AM »
Nark, you DID vote for us to keep it they way it is right now with smite turned off.

you're good. don't worry. i know what you'd want.
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #26 on: September 01, 2015, 10:45:10 AM »
I think we should either keep it positive only, or turn it off altogether.  The way it is now, with just positive, is fine with me.  If we have to go back to allowing negative, I think we should have the modification Chipper is talking about.  Either the person giving negative rep looses a positive, or by giving a negative point they get a negative.  I like the former (giving negative deletes a positive).  That's my opinion and I'm not changing it.  It incentivizes the person to not abuse the negative system.  I'd also still like the option for people to turn off their rep system on a case-by-case basis..  Meaning they turn off their rep, while others can still enjoy theirs.

No, I wasn't the only one complaining of abuse of the karma system.  A few others were too.  I'm also not the only one who thinks it was being abused.  By now, by my count, I'd have -25 Karma points.  Do you honestly think that's warranted?  I try to be helpful on here, post good posts, apologize when I fuck up.  You can't convince me that some of those points weren't based on negative personal feelings.  That's NOT what the karma system is for.  Negative Karma is for disagreeing on a strong level.  By strong level I mean something you adamantly disagree with.  It's not meant for the casual disagreement, or ambivalence to posts.  Some people were abusing the system.

As for me being an admin, thanks for the vote of confidence.   ::)   I'll say this again, I didn't ask to be an admin.  I told Chipper I didn't want to be obligated to be here or do work when I didn't want to.  He said there wouldn't be any obligations.  Since I've been one though, I think I've done more good than bad.  I think people who disagree are probably letting their personal feelings enter into the equation.  I think some people thought I was going to automatically ban them, fuck with them, or be on some power trip.  I've not done any of those things.  The only thing I've reacted to was in the Opiophile Is Down thread, and that was b/c it was extremely personal to me.  It had to do with me as a member, not an admin.  Those feelings and opinions weren't meant to be some mandate for the entire board.  I would have thought that was obvious.  Apparently not. 

As I said, I'm more than willing to give people second chances.  I'm willing to put the past behind us.  But what I'm not willing to do is constantly defend myself against naysayers..  If the majority of people honestly don't want me in power, they're certainly free to vote me out when the time comes.  In all honesty I expected not to win anyway, even if I did stand for election.

Can someone explain how its even possible for the rep to be "abused"? Apparently giving an admin more negative rep than they feel they deserve is "abuse"?

I agree with neighbor. Just do away with it, really not a big deal to me. But if this place is to be a democracy, that option needs to win in the poll.

I already explained that.  Please read again.  Applies to me and a few other people.

Where does it say that karma can't/ isn't meant to be used to express negative personal feelings? That may be your opinion/ interpretation, but you didn't create the karma system so you can't say what it should/ shouldn't be used for. Why can't it be used for negative personal feelings or disagreement on a not-so-strong level?

You may not like the way it was being used, but that doesn't mean it was being misused/ abused.

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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #27 on: September 01, 2015, 10:50:03 AM »
Nark, you DID vote for us to keep it they way it is right now with smite turned off.

you're good. don't worry. i know what you'd want.

OK, good.  I thought maybe "no support" meant no work was needed on the negative karma, as in it didn't need to be modified (i.e., the old system).

...............................

JDub, yeah, that is my interpretation.  Do you think it fair that people should use the negative karma for personal negative feelings though?  So you're basically saying if Member A doesn't like Member B, then Member A can smite Member B to hell.  That's great.   ::)   Do you think that promotes a harmonious board?  If anything, it causes anger and resentment.  Especially since you can't see who's giving you the negative. 

I'd like to think everyone on here is a decent person, who would choose to give negative rep the way I was suggesting it be used.  Apparently that's not the case for some. 

Edit: And what do personal feelings have to do with negative rep anyway?  The negative rep you're giving is for that particular post.  Do you think it right that Member A who had an argument with Member B a year ago, six months ago, 1 month ago, should give out negative rep for Member B's post simply b/c they're upset?  What does that have to do with their post?  Personal feelings should NOT be taken into account when giving negative rep.  Some people were doing that.  You just admitted that's how you interpreted the system.  Don't you think that's abuse?  And as I've said countless times now, it wasn't just me who thought the system was abused.  There were ALSO a few others. 

And as for mild / "not-so-strong" disagreements.  Well, would you smite / punch someone out in your everyday life simply because you disagreed with them slightly?  I'd hope not.  Do you think it's okay to behave that way simply b/c this is online?  Assholery is assholery, wherever it takes place. 
« Last Edit: September 01, 2015, 11:10:00 AM by Narkotikon »
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #28 on: September 01, 2015, 10:58:57 AM »
a few can indeed, ruin it for all. pity.
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Re: Poll: (3 opt's) re. Negative Karma / Negative Reputation
« Reply #29 from previous page: September 01, 2015, 11:23:50 AM »
jdub, whilst I inherently agree, the system was abused so it had to go ... high neg. counts can attack the psyche.
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